Pop Culture Corner: What Does It All Mean? Sean McGinty and Jennifer Bell Talk Zombies

Jennifer:  I guess this discussion arose from your own mention of an interest in zombies. This got me thinking. In all honesty, up until February 2015, I really never gave them a serious thought. I’ll tell you a little about how my own preoccupation began, and then I’d like to hear from you.

First, I’m very much into the world of writing and the Arts, and what it means for Christians to be both writers/artists and patrons of the Arts. Second, I think TV is undergoing a kind of renaissance, in which the quality has blossomed. There’s something big writer snobs like me talk a lot about: “Literary TV.” This TV Renaissance, so to speak, has totally sucked me in—and I’m no longer dissing TV. Though a lot of it is sooooo very dumb. Third, trends in pop culture fascinate me. What leads to these trends? What do they say about culture? About Christianity? Fourth, I said I’m a snob. I am. I probably shouldn’t say that. Especially in a churchy forum. But, well, my husband and I—having neared the very end of the Great American Novel of Television, “Mad Men”—decided to turn on “The Walking Dead.” Sick fascination? Lurid interest? Zombies are—let’s face it—in. A total cultural phenomenon. So we tried it out.

Sean, let me tell you this: I freakin’ love that show!

Originally, I thought it was dumb (I don’t anymore) and, line-by-line, the writing was weak. Now, I’d suggest that—despite plot holes and unanswered questions—the story is pretty strong. But what’s the deal? Sean, what is your own interest? And should Christians pay attention to this cultural phenomenon?

Sean: Whenever I start thinking about the zombie genre, I end up thinking about a movie that doesn't have a single one: Carriers, the 2009 film starring Chris Pine (the new Capt. Kirk). Quick plot overview: Two brothers and their girlfriends travel across a plague-devastated America in hopes of reaching a childhood vacation spot. The group has adopted a set of rules which need to be strictly followed if they want to stave off infection (ex: Don't try to help the sick because they're already dead). The course of the trip tests how dedicated the foursome truly is to those rules and how they react when they're on the wrong side of them. 

“Rotten Tomatoes” clearly disagrees with me on this, but I think it's a great movie. And relevant to our discussion. It's one that reflects most of the elements that are so attractive in the zombie genre . First on that list, Independence: and not necessarily the good kind. Zombies are the quintessential American monster. I mean, it's a hoard of people that sweep clean the existing government and society, allowing the survivors to set up their own vision of order. That's American Soul 101. The first scene of Carriers has the kids in a stolen Benz, driving through a Western landscape, drinking beer and acting like it’s spring break. It's the picture of freedom from authority, and we love it. It's the same reason John Wayne was a star, striking out to places where he could make his own law and play the game however he liked. Looking at “The Walking Dead,” we see it when Glenn hops in that red sports car and peels out of Atlanta on the wrong side of the road. Nobody tells us what to do.

Jennifer: First, I just added Carriers to my Netflix queue. Second, be very careful what you say about “The Walking Dead.” No spoilers allowed!

Sean: No spoilers, promise. So theme # 1 is Independence. Theme #2 is the presence of Moral Dilemma. The zombie genre is able to engage viewers by pushing the moral stakes to the maximum. It let's us fiddle around with the question of what we would do in similar circumstances. It's a powerful hook although, more often than not, zombie movies bungle it. They tend to contrast merely flawed protagonists with über-wicked bad guys. Since we naturally identify with the hero, I think it causes us to belittle our own fallenness. We like to think of ourselves as Rick Grimes instead of the blatantly evil Governor. Yeah, we're a little messed up; we make mistakes, but deep down we're pretty okay. We do terrible stuff sometimes, but it's justified. Carriers never gives us that option. Without revealing too much, the characters’ attempt to set up their own independence via the rules for survival proves disastrous. These aren't people who help us affirm the basic goodness of humanity. In fact, the character we most identify with, the one who seems the most moral throughout the movie, is the one who commits what is arguably the worst crime of all. And the film doesn't go on to excuse it. It just leaves you with the question of how much are you willing to lose in order to do the right thing.

Jennifer: I can’t wait to see this freakin’ film. (Good point, though, on this basic goodness issue. Much of the artistic offerings we see do not deal with the fallen nature of humankind. We are all Rick Grimes, a pretty good guy.)

Sean:  I think you'll like Carriers. But, finally, the zombie genre is popular simply because it's violent. Theme #3 is Violence.  I had a professor in college who occasionally made shows for the History Channel. He bemoaned the fact that the network required images of sex or violence at least every two minutes in order to keep the viewers attention. “The Walking Dead” is particularly egregious on this count. The producers have routinely giggled like sixth graders about how they're allowed to make the show as bloody as they like. And, ultimately, this is one of the things that holds the show back. “The Walking Dead” is consistently able to ride the wave of shock value instead of working on its many weaknesses.

Jennifer: You know, I’m not totally sure I agree with you on the appeal of violence, but I would need to think more about it. I don’t think I’m into the violence and gore. I think I like the other two things you mentioned, though, and the idea of exploring how the future is constructed by secular society: that interests me a lot. But I need to think more about it.

Without spoilers, what would you say are its weaknesses? If you can’t say without revealing plot stuff, don’t say it.

Sean: I think the main problem is, as you pointed out, the weak writing. You're somewhere in Season 2, right? By the second half of Season 4, it's like they realized that dialogue isn't their forte and just decided to eliminate as much as possible.

Jennifer: I’m sorry to hear that.

Sean: Pacing is also a major issue. By their very nature, zombie stories usually turn into either road trips or sieges. That doesn't give you a ton to work with, and I suspect that's why we get whole episodes of characters going on supply runs . . . and not completing them before the credits roll. That wouldn't be a huge problem if the characters were fleshed out well, but the majority of them have always seemed two-dimensional. And, again, the extreme violence acts as camouflage for all this.

Jennifer: I just want to quickly interrupt you to mention that the road trip element, while not at all unique to Americans, definitely has a special appeal. So, with this zombie apocalypse, we’ve got this admixture of elements like the cowboy/anarchist/renegade, the road trip, and future anxiety. But back to you . . .

Sean: Carriers is a strong contrast here. It doesn't get bogged down with voyeuristic violence. The movie draws its tension from moral choices and relationships, which creates a more lasting impression than the numbing gore of “The Walking Dead.” 

As to whether or not it's important for Christians to be paying attention to the current monster zeitgeist, I'd say no. TV and movies can be fun to watch and discuss, but I don't think they offer much value to the Christian life other than that. I'm of the opinion that Christians are way too concerned with pop culture trends. It seems as though this stems either from the belief that the Gospel isn't interesting enough on its own and needs to be hidden in whatever is popular at the moment, or from the desire to not be seen as all that different from our non-Christian neighbors. These positions, if maintained, will inevitably lead to a watering down of God's Word, a hyper-spiritualization of trivial things, and the dangerous pride of wanting to be thought well of by the world. So sure, relax with a movie or a little TV, but I don't think we should consider it more important than that.

Jennifer:  Oh, no, Sean! I hope you’re up for this. I’m about to totally, unequivocally disagree with you!

Sean: No problem, I like a good back and forth.

Jennifer: Well, first, some kindly affirmation of your thought process! I like what you’re saying about zombies as the quintessential American monster, though—and this is probably important—they have Haitian roots, as well as other important non-American sources. Perhaps what is even more significant than the monster is the response. The response to zombies may be the quintessential American response: Zombies turn us all into cowboys, and cowboys are American.

Sean: I think the Haitian origin of zombies fits nicely into their categorization as American. They're immigrants! And they change pretty dramatically once they land here. The Haitian zombie was sort of like an undead robot controlled by a voodoo wizard. The modern "destroy-the-brain!" hoard didn't show up until Romero's Night of the Living Dead. And yes, I do hate myself a little bit for knowing this much about zombies.

Jennifer: Still, though, why zombies? Doesn’t some other kind of apocalypse evoke the same response? What is so especially important about the Zombie Apocalypse? Why the masses of brainless dead people?

Sean: I'm not sure the zombie apocalypse is really all that different from the wider dystopian genre. Many of the elements that are common in zombie movies are found in series like The Hunger Games or Divergent. I imagine part of the popularity is due to the violence, but I also think it's just a matter of fashion. A decade ago vampires were everywhere; now it's zombies. In another ten years, it'll be Bigfoots or something. Try to turn that one into a supernatural romance, Hollywood!

Jennifer: I’m a little all over the place here, so bear with me—but one of my first responses to “The Walking Dead,” when we began watching and I was all skeptical, was that the brainlessness took something away for me. What? A challenge? They’re dumb! Why is that the face of the apocalypse?

And this is why I’m ultimately disagreeing with you. I think pop culture and TV reflects the heart of the audience, and those interested in zombies are, through their interest, expressing spiritual preoccupations. I have definitely thought about this in terms of the preponderance of apocalyptic films (ranging from I am Legend to The Book of Eli, to barely skim the surface). There are reasons for this preoccupation. They reflect spiritual anxieties, desires, hopes. Where is meaning found in the apocalypse? Why is the apocalypse always so lousy, so fearful? The future is inevitably scary and hopeless. What makes one a hero in the apocalypse?

And, once one has accepted this preoccupation with the end times, we might turn to a secondary question. Why zombies, our favorite apocalyptic creation?

So, let me turn it over to you with this challenge: there’s no such thing as watching TV for the mere purpose of entertainment. We’re selling ourselves short. We need to take every thought captive. Even zombies. Especially zombies. TV as mere entertainment is—dare I say it—distasteful to me.

Sean:  I wouldn't necessarily disagree with the notion that popular TV and film reflect spiritual characteristics of the viewers and creators, but a lot of things do that. Your conversations with your coworkers, the way you spend your money, how you act in a traffic jam: they all reflect the heart to some degree. So my push-back question is what makes TV so special? 

Or, look at it this way, do Christians need TV and movies to grow spiritually? Did Christians prior to the 20th century have a more difficult time increasing in faithfulness? Clearly not, nor would many of those past Christians point to the pop culture elements of their own time as being particularly important.

The only thing that really lays open the heart is God's Word. Scripture describes itself as a sharp sword able to pierce the intentions of a person. The Spirit works through the Word to reveal our sinfulness and the redemption of that sinfulness on the Cross. These are the things that draw us closer to the Lord and subsequently allow us to love people better. Television and movies can't do that, and so I'm hard pressed to think of them as having much importance for the Christian life.

Now, I can appreciate the argument that TV could help us get a bead on cultural issues, which can potentially be useful in communicating the Gospel to non-Christians. Yet, even here, I wouldn't put too much emphasis on it. While every time and place has its own particulars, the humanity of The Aeneid is the same humanity of “The Walking Dead.” That is to say, pop culture isn't really telling us anything we didn't already know. The longing for redemption, for example, is always there. It expresses itself in different ways, but it's not as if Daryl's growth as a character suddenly opens our eyes to its reality.

Jennifer: Them’s fightin’ words, Sean! I won’t go crazy on you, though—and we can’t go on and on about this exhaustively, though it’s tempting. I’m stung by your suggestion that pop culture isn’t really telling us anything we didn't already know. For me, this raises many, many important questions: Is TV “art”? Is it a “low-brow” form of art? Is pop culture also “low-brow”? Is Art or TV or pop culture merely reflective, as opposed to being its own constructive or creative force? And, finally, is Daryl’s growth as a character opening my eyes in any way?

Very briefly, I do want to say this. I really think—and I’ve thought about this way too much—that TV is an art form, and it’s also undergoing a fairly spectacular renaissance, as I mentioned earlier, as it moves closer and closer to the novel. Recent years have revealed something along the lines of literary TV with serialization, which you find in such shows as “The Walking Dead” or “Mad Men.” Unlike the classic daytime soap opera, these new shows worry over big, complex themes—the stuff of Art with a capital A. There’s still a lot of garbage, of course, and “The Walking Dead” is no Sistine Chapel—but the potential for TV is there.

And, in saying this, I would strongly, adamantly, wildly, and ruthlessly argue that Art and pop culture are not merely reflective. In these things, one may see how reality is understood, indeed. But, in these things, one may also see reality better and more clearly than one ever has before. Art and pop culture can offer visions of reality that make sense to us, that help us to comprehend our world, that enlighten us in unheard of ways. I can look at Darryl and understand what it means to be a human made in the Image of God—in a way I’ve never, ever considered before.

I’m going to end here, just because I have to. Final thoughts?

Sean: First off, let me thank you for the discussion. I had a great time talking with you about this! Back to the topic at hand...

In regards to what qualifies as art, I feel completely unequipped to tackle the question. But I'd love to hear you talk about it with one of the RCC artists! So let me sidestep that topic and go on to some of the other issues you raise.

My main concern in this conversation is twofold: one, the static nature of humanity and, two, the sufficiency of Scripture for godliness. In regards to the nature of humanity, I'd reject any notion that modern humanity is inherently different from ancient humanity, and that art is therefore necessary to show us the ever-changing aspects of mankind (just to clarify, I'm not saying you hold to this idea, but it seems to me that this is the logical endpoint of the ideas being advocated). And so it's in this sense that I'm saying that pop culture isn't telling us anything new. Not that individuals can't learn something from pop culture, but that, in light of the broad swath of humanity's history, pop culture doesn't have a new, unique message. 

Second, and this is related to the first point, I believe Scripture provides all we need in order to grow in Christ. Now, that doesn't mean that God hasn't used His people throughout the ages to help us understand Scripture, just that there is no other source of revelation that tells us about increasing in faith. So, with that in mind, I have to absolutely disagree with you about Darryl showing what it means to be made in the Image of God in an unheard of way. We see what it means to be made in the Image of God by looking to the perfect embodiment of the Image of God: Jesus Himself. If Darryl shows us the Image of God in a new way, that means Christ is somehow lacking, and, besides being incorrect, leads to a host of other problems.

Jennifer:  Yeah, I think unheard of way isn’t right.

Sean: Let me use a pop culture example other than “The Walking Dead” to try to sum up my views. Last week, Christianity Today posted an article with the eye-rolling title of "The Prophetic Voice of Leslie Knope," highlighting the main character of the TV show “Parks and Recreation” and, in particular, her love for friends and community. Now, putting aside the question of whether or not a message which doesn't involve God or His Word could ever be described as prophetic, does the message that “Parks and Rec” sends mean that it's important for Christians to watch it? I'd say no. While Christians can, and must, affirm the love of friends and community, we do so because of Scripture's revelation, not because we see it on TV. Indeed, we see exactly what this love is only because of Scripture. The proper use of “Parks and Rec” is to treat it as an enjoyable and entertaining reminder of particular type of love. And that, I think, is the chief purpose of Art (without saying that “Parks and Rec” does or doesn't qualify for the category), to show us beauty and glorify the Lord as the source of all beauty. Art is a mirror that's enriching. Art is not a source of revelation. So, going back to my earlier statement, go ahead and enjoy TV and movies. Hopefully, the good ones will remind you of important things. Hopefully, the good ones will be beautiful. But a Christian isn't spiritually hindered by not watching movies, going to the museum, or visiting the Sistine Chapel. 

Jennifer:  Thanks, Sean. And I love “Parks and Rec.” Though maybe not as much as “The Walking Dead”! Oh, no! Did I just say that aloud? If you’re an Artist—or an Artiste—and you’d like to do one of these über-fascinating dialogues (because you know we don’t fully agree with Sean), let me know.